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Author
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Topic: global west, maier, or c&e= subframes?
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my65
Journeyman Posts: 99
From: Dearborn
Registered: May 2004
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posted 01-24-2006 07:39 PM
 
Which is the best, or the best for the money? I like the global west ones for $145. Moneymaker seems to like C&E, which cost $100 from summit. Maier seems to have the best ones out of the three because they weld up in four positions. Cost is $240 though. How much have you mustang guys been paying to have them welded in?I have a 65 mustang that probably won't see the racetrack, but I want my car to be structurally sound for many years to come.
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kcode
Gearhead Posts: 3415
From: alvaton,ky,usa Suburb of Bowling Green, M&M #79, MCA #29208
Registered: Jun 99
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posted 01-24-2006 07:59 PM
For the money, buy the CE bolt ons, then weld them in. Thats what I did on the coupe.------------------
Mike Golliver
MCA Gold Card Judge-Modifieds
65 Kcode coupe 347 stroker modified 5-speed MCA Retired
66 convertible-3 dueces and a 5-speed with a 289
01 Mustang GT Convt
05 F-150 4x4 CrewCab
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Stan
Gearhead Posts: 162
From: Castro Valley, CA
Registered: Jul 99
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posted 01-24-2006 08:20 PM
I live about 4 miles from Maier, have had friends install them and have visited his shop. As far as I'm concerned, his is the best. I would suggest that if you have any specific question that you call Mike. He's EXTREMELY knowledgeable about suspensions, etc., plus he's a great guy.
Stan------------------
Past President of Bay Area Mustang Association.
1965 Fastback
2001 GT
1966 Coupe
www.BayAreaMustangAssociation.org
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Tom G
Gearhead Posts: 1069
From: Bethlehem, Pa USA
Registered: Nov 2001
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posted 01-24-2006 08:24 PM
quote:
Originally posted by kcode:
For the money, buy the CE bolt ons, then weld them in. Thats what I did on the coupe.
Diddo!!!------------------
67 Mustang F/B 302 GT-40X FMS engine RPM Air Gap 650 Holley DP Crane 1.7 roller rockers, Edelbrock Performer Nitrous, Dynomax ceramic headers WCZ rated-T5, cable clutch Flows X Pipe 3.89 9". Clearwater Aqua GT Clone Vintage wheel works 40 series 16X8 225 front 255/50 rear drag radials 308 RWHP@5800rpm 300 tq NA 385rwhp 380 w 75 shot 13.11 @111mph
92 VERT triple black 5 speed, 88 GT (FiveOfastback's ride)GT 40 X Track Heat, BBK headers X pipe 5 spd Red and Silver
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buening
Gearhead Posts: 317
From: Decatur, IL
Registered: Mar 2005
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posted 01-25-2006 08:21 AM
I've said it many times, if you want the stiffest subframe connectors out there then check out TinMan Fabrications. He makes his own and they are the thickest steel i have found yet. No trimming the rear floorboards either.http://www.tinmanfabrication.com/Products.aspx An some pics of them installed:
http://www.midnightdsigns.com/Mustang/subframe.html ------------------
1970 Grabber Blue Mach 1 H-code
1970 Fastback
2003 Torch Red Mustang
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68 Coop
Gearhead Posts: 5847
From: Mesquite, NV. 89027
Registered: Oct 2004
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posted 01-25-2006 08:36 AM
Those are bad ass.------------------
William
The easiest way to find something lost, is to buy a replacement. 68 Coupe
289
C4
2:79 rear gears
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Ryan Wilke
Gearhead Posts: 3237
From: Stanton, Michigan, zip 48888
Registered: Oct 2000
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posted 01-25-2006 12:08 PM
I bought a pair of C&E units;
http://www.competitionengineering.com/catalog/CategoryDisplay.asp?CatCode=10054
...but I didn't want to cut up my floorboards to install them. So I finally sold the C&E units and kept looking. I then bought the Maier Racing Enterprises units, part #MS2201;
http://www.maierracing.com/
I blocked up the car under all four wheels (so that car was still resting on it's tires/suspension straight & level). I grinded the areas clean where the welds would be made, then I asked a friend to bring his welder over & he welded them in in about an hour. I gave him 50$ for the job. The MRE connectors ARE REALLY stout and I have never regretted springing for the extra cost and I didn't have to cut & reweld my floorboards. Now I'm confident that I can put any kind of power, even go bigblock, and the car will stay straight! Just my 2 cents,,,,,
Ryan  ------------------
'69 Mach I; 306"/4-spd; drag racer.
'65 F100 Short box; 390"/4-spd; Tow Truck.
'85 GT Convert.; last carb'd 5.0L/5-spd; street cruiser.
'94 Ranger; 4cyl/5-spd; commuter/parts hauler.
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Scott302
Journeyman Posts: 45
From: Livonia, MI, USA
Registered: Mar 2001
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posted 01-26-2006 06:06 PM
Keep in mind that all other things being equal (i.e. wall thickness, outside dimension) round tubing is stronger than square tubing. I am told this is especially true of torsional strength that would be the main stress on the connectors.
Also just a thought for some who might read this...bolt-in connectors-never. Take them and weld them in. Bolting in a sub frame connector will do nothing for your car but make the holes you drilled to attach them larger!------------------
Scott Halseth
National Parts Depot
65 Convt
66 Coupe
03 Coupe
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BornInAFord
Gearhead Posts: 610
From: Bend, OR, USA
Registered: Dec 2002
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posted 01-29-2006 01:53 AM
While it's true that round tubing is more rigid than square, this might be a moot point. Why would we need a round tube to connect two boxed (square) subframes?  Just thinking out loud.  BTW, since you are modifying already, why not mock up and add l-tabs to weld the cheaper subframes in multiple spots, à la Maier? Then again, if you go with Total Control's subframe + bolt in x-member you might even be more rigid.
Daniel
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Scott H
Gearhead Posts: 1480
From: Chicago area
Registered: Mar 2005
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posted 01-29-2006 05:43 AM
quote:
Originally posted by BornInAFord:
Why would we need a round tube to connect two boxed (square) subframes?
I would say the square subframe connectors would be strong enough if you welded them along their entire length, that way they can't twist in the middle. Since most people only attach the connectors at the front and rear you need the extra torsional resistance of a tube to make it strong enough to be effective.
Anybody seen any square driveshafts?
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Scott302
Journeyman Posts: 45
From: Livonia, MI, USA
Registered: Mar 2001
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posted 01-29-2006 11:00 AM
Or square roll bars.
As far as welding a sqaure tube along it's entire length, you're right. The cars unibody is a series of welded box sections. If you want to add square subframe connectors just install convertible frame rails and torque boxes.Also a comment on frame reinforcements between the connectors: If you have installed the frame connectors you already have strengthened the center 1/3 or so of the unibody. Adding an X-frame between those won't change the rigidity very much. If you were to add to the connectors by welding in pieces OUTWARD to the rockers then you would have added tremendously to the rigidity of the unibody. Take a piece of sheet metal (or paper for that matter) hold it on both sides and twist it. The sheet flexes more at the sides than in the center. ------------------
Scott Halseth
National Parts Depot
65 Convt
66 Coupe
03 Coupe
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dodgestang
Gearhead Posts: 207
From: Cecil County, MD, USA
Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 01-29-2006 01:20 PM
I like my TCP subframes on my 65 They even have a little pocket that my Underriders welded into. ------------------
Nick
65FB 408c AOD D.T. Mustangs are like Rabbits, except mustangs can reproduce a-sexually.
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mellowyellow
Gearhead Posts: 8198
From: So. Fl.
Registered: Aug 2000
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posted 01-29-2006 01:32 PM
Considering a modification on my 68 Cv. Like some feedback. Consider: A Cv has an additional frame rail, an inner rocker panel per side, and they're beefy. The Cv also has a heavy lower seat pan that's bolted together over the driveshaf tunnel with a thick plate. Plus they are welded to the inner floor support, per side. So....what about extending a tube from the rear of the lower seat pan to the rear torque box? Doing this you really have a subframe connector.
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my65
Journeyman Posts: 99
From: Dearborn
Registered: May 2004
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posted 01-29-2006 02:56 PM
In case anyone was wondering, I've decided to go with tinman subframes. It looks like the best for the money, plus they responded to my emails right away. I like that.
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